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General Guide: http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=124 CP+ camera and imaging event (March 2nd weekend) : http://www.cpplus.jp/en/index.html Photokina camera and imaging event (Sep middle) : http://www.photokina-cologne.com/ Camera shop in China Map * [[http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=208217845273800967430.0004a6c211ecafd33fdc6&msa=0&ll=23.12268,113.295822&spn=0.120614,0.117073|My map of Guangzhou lens shops]] * [[http://maps.google.com.sg/maps/ms?msid=208217845273800967430.0004a880f706227e4081c&msa=0&ll=13.740615,100.564921&spn=0.015716,0.033023|My map for the Bangkok lens shops]] * Vietnam camera forum: http://www.xomnhiepanh.com/ ====== Singapore & Hong Kong Camera Shops Price Guide====== * DD Eletronics: http://www.ddelectronics.com.sg/?islocated=Yes * (tons of cheap Sigma lens, like 150-500mm, and some camera body) * ArtworkFoto: http://www.artworkfoto.com/index.html * (60 SGD [[http://www.artworkfoto.com/flash_accessories.html|ring flash]];12 SGD Portable and lightweight Mini Travel Tripod) * Old manual lens: http://lens.sg * Samyang manual lens and mirror lens: http://www.sgcamerastore.com/ * (got cheap 20+ SGD 1.2kg-holding Flexible Pod, and 8 SGD small one; 10SGD lens pounch; 54 SGD wireless flash trigger set) * 35 SGD fotomate monopod, 40 SGD steadepod * Adapter rings and flash cables: http://www.mymonstercamera.com/ * (got 40 SGD off-flash cable and 10 SGD shutter remote) * Chiif Camera: http://www.chiifcameras.com/ * Alan Photo: http://www.alanphoto.com.sg/ * Tin Cheung camera: http://www.tincheungcamera.com.hk/ **Bangkok, Thailand** * World Camera: http://shop.worldcamera.co.th/ * Fotofile: http://www.fotofile.net/ * CameraCollection: http://www.cameracollection.net/ **Interesting Reading** [[http://www.petapixel.com/2011/08/16/digital-rot-the-sad-truth-about-digital-cameras-and-depreciation/|Film and Digital camera value through years]] ====== Camera and Lens Review site====== | [[http://www.dpreview.com|Dpreview]] | [[http://the-digital-picture.com/|DigtialPicture]] | Bird photography and high zoom FAQs (How much zoom power you need?) | [[http://www.birdsasart.com/faq.html|BirdSasArt]] | [[http://www.pbase.com/wsusanto/|WsusantoGallery]] | Lens and Works * food photography * jewelry photography [[http://jewelryphotography.com/|site01]] * product photography * landscape photography (large format) [[http://www.betterlight.com/featuredPhotog_Index.html|example]] * portrait photography * sport photography [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Py9UQGKZ00I&feature=related|long prime]] [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPY74vtMiEQ&feature=related|pro speed]] [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YprbBVlMMI&feature=related|Pro kit]] * macro photography * bird and safari photography [[http://www.safari-guide.co.uk/panasonic-lumix-dmc-fz100-digital-camera.php|safari guide]] * aero photography * others event based: sports, wedding ====== Auto Focus Lens combination price range ====== ^ pack 1 ^ pack 2 ^ pack 3 ^ pack 4 ^ one-for-all ^ other ^ | 18-55mm | 18-135mm | 24-70mm | 18-50mm | 18-200mm | 100-400mm | |SGD 150-800|SGD 280-1350|SGD 250-1580|SGD |SGD 350-850 | SGD 1800 | | 55-250mm | 150-500mm | 70-200mm | 50-500mm | 18-250mm | 1.4 ext | |SGD 250-430 |SGD 1400 |SGD 550-1400 |SGD 1400-2000 |SGD 450-600 | SGD 300| | 400mm | | 70-300mm | | 28-300mm | 2x ext | |f5.6 1400| |SGD 200-700| | SGD 250-700 | SGD 170 | Primes ^ 50mm ^ 90mm ^100mm ^ 300mm ^ 400mm ^ 500mmf4 is^ |f1.8 70 |SGD 300-500|f2.8 400-650|f2.8 6000|f5.6 1400-1600 | SGD 7600 | |f1.4 250-450^135mm ^200mm | | ^ 600mmf4 | |f1.2 1900 |f2 1100 |f2.8 850-1200| | | SGD 6300 | Wide-angle lens ^ 10~24mm ^ 16~35mm ^ | SGD 600-880 | SGD 35-1600 | * Full frame advantage on wide-angle lens: [[http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/nikon_16-35_2p8_vr_n15/|example compare on 16-35mm]] * tilt-shift lens, a photo demo study: [[http://www.the-digital-picture.com/reviews/Canon-TS-E-17mm-f-4-L-Tilt-Shift-Lens-Review.aspx|example on 17mm TS lens]] ====== Lens Review for Common use ====== for 18-55mm, all kit lens has this range, so no need to talk about it. {{photowiki:angle_of_view.jpg|}} ===== 70-200mm ===== ^ ^canon f4|canon f4 is|canon f2.8 is II|sigma f2.8^tamron f2.8| ^price|5000 cny|8600 cny|15000 cny|5700 cny|5500 cny| ^ ^1000 sgd|1600 sgd|3000 sgd|1150 sgd^1100 sgd| ^weight|705g|760g|1.5kg|1.3kg|1.3kg| ^length|17cm|17cm|20cm|19cm|19cm| ^filter|67mm|67mm|77mm|77mm|77mm| ^year|1999|2006|2010|2007|2008| ^f|4-32|4-32|2.8-32|2.8-22|2.8-32| ^focus|1.2m|1.2m|1.2m|1m|0.95m| ^blade|8|8|8|9|9| ^IS|no|yes|yes|no|no| ^structure|13g16p|15g20p|19g23p|15g18p|13g18p| ^note|LLW||LW||| ^corner sharpness|4.5|4.4|4.5|3.8|3.8| ^bg bluriness|3|3|4|4|4| ^review| | |[[http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1029&message=36154929&changemode=1|with 2x ext]] | | | note: one lens may be bad for a landscape photographer, but may actually be good enough for portrait photographer. Because, - for landscape and nature scene shot, corner to corner sharpness is more important, * fast aperture like f2.8 is not that important, as the scene is not moving * shallow depth of field of f2.8 is no use, as landscape scene shot need deep sharp view to the infinity * background blur is no use for landscape, as your subject is the background, and you don't want to blur it - for portrait shot, corner sharpness is not that important while blurry background is more important * fast aperture like f2.8 is important, as people can move fast * shallow depth of field of f2.8 is important, as you need blurry background to pop the portrait more * corner sharpness is not important as long as your portrait is in the center of lens - for close-up shot, like flower or birds, f4 is enough to blur out the background * fast aperture like f2.8 is optional, as f4 is enough to blur out the background because of that close object distance of long zoom focus length * corner sharpness is not that important, as long as your object is in the center part of lens. Conclusion on 70-200mm range: * f2.8 is priority consideration when shooting **center-framed** portrait is your main goal with lens at this range. * corner sharpness is priority consideration when shooting landscape is your main goal with lens at this range * cheap price is priority consideration when you are on a budget, * for landscape photographer, choose Canon 70-200mm f4L no-IS version * for portrait photographer, choose Sigma f2.8 (fast focus) or Tamron f2.8 (bit slow focus)version * for mixed photographer, choose Sigma f2.8, you can always stop aperture down to f5.6 to get corner sharpness back for landscape * quality is priority consideration when money is no-issue to you and you can earn the money back out from your photos * get Canon f2.8 for the flexibility and sharp all the way and blur all the way as you like * IS (image stabilize) is priority consideration when you shoot in the evening or indoor at most time and don't want to carry a tripod ===== 24-70mm ===== on a 1.6x crop factor Canon DSLR, it means 44-112mm range. ^ ^sigma f2.8-4|sigma f2.8^tamron f2.8|canon f2.8^canon f4| ^price|3200 cny|3650 cny|3000 cny|9700 cny|6900 cny| ^ ^600 sgd|700 sgd^600 sgd|2000 sgd^1200 sgd| ^weight|535g|715g|510g|950g|670g| ^length|9cm|11.5cm|9cm|12cm|10cm| ^filter|72mm|82mm|67mm|77mm|77mm| ^year|||||| ^f|f2.8-22|f2.8-32|f2.8-32|f2.8-22|f4-22| ^focus|0.22m|0.4m|0.33m|0.38m|0.45m| ^blade|7|9|7|8|8| ^IS|yes|no|no|no|yes| ^structure|13g17p|13g14p|14g16p|13g16p|13g18p| ^note|17-70mm|24-70mm|28-75mm||24-105mm| ^corner sharpness|4.5|3.5|4.3|4.3|4| ^bg bluriness|3.9|4|4|4|3| ===== 35mm, 50mm and 85mm prime ===== on 1.6x crop factor Canon DSLR, it means 80mm and 136mm. ^ ^canon 50mm 1.4|sigma 50mm 1.4|canon 50mm f1.8^canon f1.8 85mm ^ Samyang f1.4 85mm manual| ^price|2550|3600 cny|500 cny|2800 cny| ^ ^500 sgd|700 sgd|100 sgd^560 sgd|400-650 sgd| ^weight|290g|505g|130g|425g|513g| ^length|5cm|6.8cm|4cm|7cm|72mm| ^filter|58mm|77mm|52mm|58mm|72mm (78)| ^year||||| ^f|f1.4-22|f1.4-16|f1.8-22|f1.8-22|f1.4-16| ^focus|0.45m|0.45m|0.45m|0.85m|1m| ^blade|8|9|5|8|?| ^IS|no|no|no|no|no| ^structure|6g7p|6g8p|5g6p|7g9p|7g9p| ^note|||||| ^corner sharpness|4|3.5|4|4.3|?| ^bg bluriness|4.5|4.5|4.5|4.5|4.8| ===== 8-24mm ===== that means, on crop factor of 1.6, 12.8mm-38mm. (<35mm) Generally, 14mm (135 format), that is 22mm(1.6crop), which is quite wide for very close portrait+environment shot and indoor. \\ 10mm (135 format), that 16mm (1.6 crop), which is extreme wide for city, \\ [[http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Sigma-8-16mm-f-4.5-5.6-DC-HSM-Lens-Review.aspx|8mm]] (12mm), which is [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7grpVEQETTs&feature=related|amazing]] for nature wide angle shot. ^ ^ sigma ^^^ Canon ^^ Tamron ^ Tokkia ^^ ^ |8-16mm | 10-20mm | 12-24mm | 10-22mm | 20mm | 10-24mm | 11-16mm | 12-24mm | ^eq 1.6x |13-25mm | 16-32mm | 19-38mm | 16-35mm | 32mm | 16-38mm | 17-25mm | 19-38mm | ^f|4.5-5.6 | 4-5.6| 4.5-5.6 | 3.5-4.5 | f2.8 | 3.5-4.5 | f2.8 | f4 | ^p|5200 cny |3900 cny | 5600 cny | 5300 cny| 3860 cny | 3700 cny | 4074 cny | 3800 cny | ^video| s1 | s2 | s3 | c1 | c2 |[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ME1G4XxSU5c|video]]| t1 | t2 | Note: on a 1.6x or 1.5 crop DSLR,those non-full-frame one, as most DSLR, loses the 17mm -35mm wide angle with the so-called kit lens (17-55mm equ. 27-88mm). Thus, the actual 17-28 range is missing from most DSLR cameras starting from the Kit lens. \\ and a extra wide lens is required to capture that wide angle. ===== 300mm to 500mm range ===== On a 1.6x crop factor Canon DSLR, it means 480mm to 800mm range, \\ which finally match today's super zoom compact's 840mm ([[http://www.dpreview.com/news/1009/10091411sx30is.asp|Canon SX30IS]]) ^ |canon 70-300mm \\ f4-5.6^canon 100-400mm \\ f4.5-5.6|tamron 200-500mm \\ f5-6.3^sigma 150-500 \\ f5-6.3|sigma 170-500 \\ f5-6.3^ Tokina 80-400mm Pro \\ f4.5-5.6 ^ ^equivalent|(112-480mm)|(160-640mm)|(320-800mm)|(240-800mm)| | (128-640mm)| ^price|9399 cny|12k cny|7350 cny|7000 cny|3500 cny| 3300 cny | ^ |2000 sgd^2400 sgd|1470 sgd^1400 sgd| ^ 600 sgd | ^2nd hand| ^1850 sgd| ^1250 sgd | ^ 400 sgd | ^weight|1kg|1.38kg|1.2kg|1.9kg|1.3kg|0.9kg| ^length|14cm|19cm|22cm|25cm| |13.6cm| ^filter|64|77|86|86| |72| ^year|2010|1998|2007 (discontinued)|2009|discontinued| | ^f|f4-45|f4.5-38|f5-32|f5-22| |f4.5-f32| ^focus|1.2m|1.8m|2.5m|2.2m| |2.5m| ^blade|8|8|9|9| |8| ^IS|yes|yes|no (Di LD IF)|yes (DG OS HSM)| |no| ^structure|14g19p|14g17p|10g13p|15g21p| |110g16p| ^note| | | | | | | ^corner sharpness| |4.2| |4.0| | | ^review| |[[http://www.flickr.com/groups/100-400l/discuss/72157624945191371/|1.4x ext]] | |[[http://www.flickr.com/groups/sigma_lenses/discuss/72157622888414030/|1.4x ext]] | | ^gallery| | | |[[http://www.flickr.com/groups/sigma150-500/|gallery]] | |[[http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=206338|gallery]] | note: long focus length zoom lens has advantage of flexibility for unpredictable situation, while long focus length prime lens has better image quality in term of sharpness and fast aperture. Thus, - when object is predictable, Prime is preferred, like [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Py9UQGKZ00I&feature=related|locational sports]] - when critical fast reaction speed and superior quality are priority, Prime is preferred - when object is hard to track and moving in various distance, Zoom is preferred, like [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4t-WdXW3rYs&feature=fvw|widelife shots]] - fast super-telephoto prime lens with f2.8 or f4 or f5.6 at 400-800mm range can be extremely heavy and expensive (more than 5000 SGD), so not discussed here. ([[http://www.pbase.com/wsusanto/kenya_2010|600mm f4 in use]]) - Image Stabilize feature is a key feature for this super-telephoto range, with so-called "IS OS VR", it [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6T8Xf4EBk4&feature=fvw|greatly stops the shake]] Flexibility of Prime super-telephoto lens, - fast prime super-telephoto lens can use 1.4x extension or 2.0x to get extra reach, * 300mm F4 prime with 2.0x extension becomes 600mm F8, still maintaining good image quality but manual focus on general DLSR. * [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsQjaT5LaFQ&feature=related|400mm f5.6 prime with 2.0x extension]] becomes 800mm F11, still maintain good image quality but manual focus or every slow auto focus Flexibility of fast telephoto zoom lens, - fast and high quality telephoto lens can use 1.4x extension or 2.0x to become super-telephoto zoom * [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0tgIw2xZ3c&feature=related|70-200mm f2.8 zoom lens with 2.0x extension]] becomes 140-400mm f5.6 zoom lens. still maintaining good image quality and auto focus * [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vv_mGw_wBU&feature=related|70-200mm f4 with 2.0x produce 140-400mm f8]], with certain degree of "auto focus" * 100-400mm f4.5-5.6 with 1.4x to become 140-560mm f6.3-7.8 with autofocus [[http://www.pbase.com/jackcnd/100_400_with_14x|gallery]] [[http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidmunro/5136960935/in/set-72157625291501452/|compare result with 1.4x and 2x ext (200-800mm f9-f11) and both (280-1120mm f12.6-f15.3)]] Quality of general super-telephoto zoom lens, - general and slow super-telephoto zoom lens with f6.3 and lower can still use extension, but image quality will decrease quite a bit, and manual focus only. - extension generally designed for high quality fast primes and zooms that can afford the light decrease through extension. ===== Macro Lens 1:1 - 35mm, 50mm, 90mm, 100mm, 150mm, 180mm ===== ^ ^ Tamron 90mm f2.8 macro ^ Canon 100mm f2.8 macro ^ Sigma 105mm 2.8 macro ^ Tamron 180mm f3.5 macro ^ ^price ^ 500 SGD | 730 SGD | ^2nd hand ^ 400 SGD | | ^weight | 405g | 600g | 450g |921g | ^diameter | 71mm | 79mm | 74mm | 84mm | ^length | 97mm | 119mm | 95mm | 165mm | ^filter | 55mm | 58mm | ^close focus|29cm | 31cm | ref: http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Tamron-90mm-f-2.8-Di-Macro-Lens-Review.aspx ====== DSLR or Compact -the Battle of Image Quality to Price Ratio ====== The important research artcile on this Question: * What "Mega Pixel war race" bring to us: [[http://pixinfo.com/en/articles/canon_powershot_g_evolution/|MP resolution vs print test]]. * Standard photo 4R size need just 2M (all size listed): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photo_print_sizes * resolution to size theoretically without resize: http://www.unlikelymoose.com/more/cameras/megapixel_converter.html Check these 2 images ^ [[http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/HS10/FULLRES/YDSCF9278.HTM|HS10]] ^ [[http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/shared/picture.asp?f=29186|Pentax K-x]] ^ [[http://pliki.optyczne.pl/min85/min85_fot01.JPG|Sony A850 (24MP)]] ^ [[http://cognitivecolor.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/ash-1.jpg|Canon 5DII (21MP)]] ^ [[http://stevehuffphotos.zenfolio.com/img/v8/p965638378.jpg|Leica M9 (18MP)]] ^ |600sgd |700sgd |2900SGD | 3000SGD | 9000SGD | Note: * The 100% view of them on screen are all not-perfect * the compact HS10: the image quality is not sharp, color fringing on lines, smearing on surface * the DSLR Pentax kx: the image is not shot steady, and bit blur on flower details. * A850 image is not sharp in the central wood as well at 100% because of focus is not set precisely on the wood * the 5D shot is a little better at noise clearness, but seems the focus is not shift to eye precisely. * Leica is famous for its optical quality, while generally, people who spend so much on that kind of camera, normally has a steady hand and sharp eye to focus right. Note 2: * use Browser's "Ctrl+" "Ctrl-" key to zoom out the images into 50%, * both images looks sharp and detail now, sharp clear fur from HS10, and contrasty flower from Kx Conclusion: * why zooming to 50% gives you good result from either Compact or DSLR, * Why zooming to 100% hardly gives you perfection * Because - simply human is not good at achieving 100% perfection, even with good camers - nowadays camera all got around 14MP or 16MP high resolution sensor, they are designed to provide with enough resolution even at 50% scale - you can get good perfect 50% scaled image at 7-8MP from any camera with relatively good steady hand * **for printing, based on this [[http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/mpmyth.htm|MegaPixel Myth]] ** - 7-8MP can print out good How-big-photo, a simple guide is - How big the Photo looks at 50% on your standard Computer Monitor, put a paper on monitor, then you got the idea * **How sharp my photo can be, check [[http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/unsharp.htm|this article]]** * Maximum Sharpness is all about your steady hand when holding the camera, * Camera tiny hand-shake can ruin the images. and motion blur out the image, * so, next time, use a tripod and camera not moving and your targets not moving within at least 1 second * With a Huge MegaPixel, that means, at 100% view, that large resolution will record clearly your even-tiny-hand-shaking caused exposure bluriness. * **The last key factor is focusing on the right spot, as Digital Compacts generally don't have a [[http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/eos/EOS-1n/Focusing/index2.htm|lens barrel ring to do precise mannual focus]], DSLR with all the full manual focus lens gives advantage, but FujiFilm bridge camera series and Sony new HX100v, these compact cameras also features a manual focus ring.** ====== Last word about Super Zoom Compact ====== ===== historic super zoom compact camera since 2003 ===== ==== 2005 ==== * [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5VPfSQP9TA|panasonic Lumix DMC FZ30]]: king of super zoom 2005([[http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicfz30/|review]]) * 1/1.8 CCD sensor, 8MP, RAW capable, 640x480 video, 12x manual zoom and focus capable super zoom (35-420mm IS), 720g, Lithium Ion battery * [[http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/sony/dsc_h1-review/|Sony H1]]: 2005 - my first super zoom and my 2nd digital camera, everything is good except precise tune of focus for bird shot * 1/2.5 CCD sensor, 5MP, no RAW, VGA video, 12x optic zoom, (36-432mm IS),438g, AA battery * other as bellow [[artwiki:camerawiki:superzoom|"Megazoom camera history and advangtage"]] moves to a new page. ====== Mounts adapters ====== Check list for mounts capability: - aperture control capability, as some lens may not have a aperture ring; - check whether the lens can focus infinity on mounts; - check whether mounts have Focus Confirmation Chip built-in ====== Singapore Camera rent price ====== As high quality lens can get extremely expensive, renting one becomes more reasonable and affortable than buying one, as some extreme heavy and expensive lenses are not used that often. * Camera Rental - http://sg.camerarental.biz/ ====== My Final Words ====== * since 2011, my research result on cheapest solution to DSLR is - buy 2nd hand 2 year old technology for best price, it is almost 1/3 of original launch price or current lastest - buy old manual focus lens, they are good enough for family use - buy very cheap, and sell it cheap for slight better thing. * in electronics age, things get cheaper every day, better buy what you need and use it fully for its value * dont waste money on buying expensive, and never use photowiki/outdate_cameraprice.txt Last modified: 2023/01/07 15:28by ying